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The Rant topic about the good'ol days of gaming.


Hendrix

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@GODSPEEDAgain to stop us from derailing a topic completely I figured we could have a place to complain in peace. 😂

I figured I could start this topic first before writing my "initial" post, since the topic is so vast and for some reason the wife thinks I have more important things to focus on. 🤔

To any and all, feel free to rant away, I'll be sure to "complain" myself in the near future.

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Omg, finally an awesome topic!

You can be certain I will be here often. There is so much crap to say about the way old games were made and the way new games are made; and I realize times change and so must we, but I can't help feel like the gaming industry has REALLY changed, and not for the best.

My first reflection on the topic is about how much the video game industry has become a "business" more than a passion, especially by companies that have become so big that things are out of control.

Look, because this is the JA3 forum, I will start by giving JA3 as an example. The game was announced back in September? Some basic footage and it's been silence since then. They can't release information because information has to be so tightly controlled. It is really the way of big corporations, not a bunch of gaming nerds who want to brag about the game they work on.

And, no, this is NOT a comment on Haemimont Games, I am pretty certain they are anxious to talk to us about their work. But today, companies need so much $$$ to make a game, they can't help but fall in the grasps of mego corporations who view things from the business perspective, how to cut corners, how to hype something, ... in the end, I feel as much time is spent in "Tactical Marketing" as there is on the actual game.


Is there a good side to it? Sure, I'm not stupid, I would prefer a good studio can have good funding, keep it's employees than always live on the edge of poverty because the gaming industry has become cutthroat! I guess I just miss when PUBLISHERS where maybe closer to earth than they are now. It wasn't perfect back then either, many flops and cheap games.. but these big corporations today must also walk a thin line with modern "politics" and media hype and cancel culture ideologies that so much freedom is lost because of restrictions or social drama.

Just take a look at how Battlefield went from a accessible military simulator to complete ignorance of history in Battlefield V & Battlefield 1.


I just really hope JA3 can keep some of that humour and light-hearted comical and stereotypical commentary intact. There was sexism, racism, sexual innuendo (Fox!), stereotypes, comedy and a tongue-in-cheek approach at the lesbian, gay and other communities.. but that tongue-in-cheek approach doesn't make you hate ppl, or cultures, or choices...

...if ANYTHING, Jagged Alliance has showed me that individual cutlures, the way they speak, they stereotypes, are interesting and they make me curious and open-minded.


Man, this rant is already becoming a book. At least I'm not hi-jacking another post! 🤣

 

In any case, I'm super open-minded to opinions, so anyone with a different opinion, please go ahead, what matters is to stay friendly! We're here because of Jagged Alliance!



 

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  • 2 weeks later...

First things first! What I am about to write is my view of the overall state of todays development of games. As whit everything there are ofcourse exceptions and my views are only my views of the matter.

As you wrote @GODSPEED. The industry has change so dramatically since the 90's. What was then considered to be large/professional studio, would hardly today be viewed as a indie studio. How many of these 90's developer's were just a group of friends/acquaintances who got togheter in an apartment and someone had an idea of a game and they just did it because they thought it was cool? 

Today everything is cautiously considered and calculated before any idea even leaves the table and the trend of "AAA" titels to include/appease as many gamers as possible tends to make games stale and whitout character/soul. Hard topics are avoided so that no one will get offended etc. But I find that to be an issiue since games then feels unrealistic because everyone just gets along all the time. Sure sometimes you want that easy kind of outcome for a game and it is hard to say what games should or should not have the player make real hard choices. But I find myself asking: When was the last time I saw a game to really be something new? I have lost count on how many times I have watched gameplay for a new game and after a few minutes considered that: OK this is just a "copy" of that game in a new dress. This does not have to be a bad thing ofcourse and I find it unavoidable since the gaming market/audience is so vastly large today. Example. I guess you saw the gameplay reveal of Starfield? My thoughts were: OK it's Skyrim/Fallout in Space but I never expected anything else either. I'll probably pick it up when every dlc is realeased and there's a 50% discount. Then they say: "We got over a thousand planets." And I get horrible flashbacks from the Mass Effect games where you had to around every planet to find resourses. Fair enough, I might be wrong about this being an issiue in the actual game.

On a complete side nonte: What the hell happend to the advancement for the AI in games?! 😂

I must admit that as a gamer I have change aswell. Simply I lack the stamina today to invest myself in a game in the same way I did 15 years ago. I find myself thinking: "Alright I have done everything for today. I can game for an hour/hour and a half and then go to bed." Then when I sit down at my computer and start everything up I am hit by an complete energy drain and instead of enjoying a game it becomes just another thing I have to invest energy into. This has caused me to start looking into other sort of games. Stuff I just can pick up and play for 30-60 min and be done. Right now I am actually thinking about getting a Nintendo Switch and get Nintendo Sports. Part of this is just me getting older, but a larger part is simply the effort I have to put into my job. I am not complaining because I like my job, there is just my limit to how much I can focus on during a day. And for different reasons the last few years my job has been very demanding. 

There's a ton more to write in the matter. I simply lack the time right now. Hope it is somewere comprehensible since I am writing this on my phone and moved the text around abit.

Cheers! 🍻

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  • 4 weeks later...
On 6/17/2022 at 9:49 AM, Hendrix said:

I guess you saw the gameplay reveal of Starfield? My thoughts were: OK it's Skyrim/Fallout in Space but I never expected anything else either. I'll probably pick it up when every dlc is realeased and there's a 50% discount. Then they say: "We got over a thousand planets." And I get horrible flashbacks from the Mass Effect games where you had to around every planet to find resourses. Fair enough, I might be wrong about this being an issiue in the actual game.

I know exactly what you mean!

I do have my own idea though from other videos I have gone to watch discussing technical things with worlds and all that. I believe it will be like any Bethesda game, many interesting locations, fun things to do here and there, but maybe lacklustre writing and more of a sandbox with a story slipped in.

I am anxious to see it, becasue I think if they can get the settlement thing well done (I spent so much time building in Fallout 4... I love simcity okay!?) and the customizing of your spaceship... I might at least enjoy exploring and discovering the worlds Bethesda are great at. But, we'll see..

 

On 6/17/2022 at 9:49 AM, Hendrix said:

On a complete side nonte: What the hell happend to the advancement for the AI in games?! 😂

There is not emoji with binoculars. But if there was, I wouldn't put him here. AI, hard to find! It requires too much time to implement, test and debug. So just put that time and effort in something eye-catching. Like graphics. 🙄 But I'm just repeating what you already know as well.

 

On 6/17/2022 at 9:49 AM, Hendrix said:

I must admit that as a gamer I have change aswell. Simply I lack the stamina today to invest myself in a game in the same way I did 15 years ago. I find myself thinking: "Alright I have done everything for today. I can game for an hour/hour and a half and then go to bed." Then when I sit down at my computer and start everything up I am hit by an complete energy drain and instead of enjoying a game it becomes just another thing I have to invest energy into. This has caused me to start looking into other sort of games. Stuff I just can pick up and play for 30-60 min and be done. Right now I am actually thinking about getting a Nintendo Switch and get Nintendo Sports. Part of this is just me getting older, but a larger part is simply the effort I have to put into my job. I am not complaining because I like my job, there is just my limit to how much I can focus on during a day. And for different reasons the last few years my job has been very demanding.

I'm also going through a similar process, many of my hobbies are taking over and sometimes it's simply because my head is already full from work and life, so sometimes sitting to learn new very complex games or time consuming RPG's is not the way I do things anymore.

Maybe this is why, for myself, I find it easy to go back to JA2 and hope JA3 is very similar.. the familiarity would be a very big advantage for myself, because I would feel I could use my experience in the series to skip having to learn whole new systems and mechanics and just get down to the fun part of the story, the characters and the battles.

Have you thought of the Steam Deck at all?

I did have a Nintendo Switch for a while about a year ago. Part of it was fun, but then just having to buy new games while I have hundreds and hundreds of PC games sitting around... it was taking my $ away from some modelling hobbies. I'm still on the fence even for the Steam Deck although I only hear good things.

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On 6/2/2022 at 8:32 PM, GODSPEED said:

but these big corporations today must also walk a thin line with modern "politics" and media hype and cancel culture ideologies that so much freedom is lost because of restrictions or social drama

Any infringment of freedom of speech in any form of media fucking disgusts me!

I am convinced that if the Western World governments starts applying these restrictions (that to some degree already are taking place) were in for future more grim than what Orwell wrote in his book 1984.

 

On 6/2/2022 at 8:32 PM, GODSPEED said:

I just really hope JA3 can keep some of that humour and light-hearted comical and stereotypical commentary intact. There was sexism, racism, sexual innuendo (Fox!), stereotypes, comedy and a tongue-in-cheek approach at the lesbian, gay and other communities.. but that tongue-in-cheek approach doesn't make you hate ppl, or cultures, or choices...

I really hope so too, I see no problem at all whit stereotypical humour, because sane people understands that it is humor.

 

On 6/2/2022 at 8:32 PM, GODSPEED said:

...if ANYTHING, Jagged Alliance has showed me that individual cutlures, the way they speak, they stereotypes, are interesting and they make me curious and open-minded.

And isn't that the best "commercial" for other cultures?

 

On 7/9/2022 at 5:16 PM, GODSPEED said:

Maybe this is why, for myself, I find it easy to go back to JA2 and hope JA3 is very similar.. the familiarity would be a very big advantage for myself, because I would feel I could use my experience in the series to skip having to learn whole new systems and mechanics and just get down to the fun part of the story, the characters and the battles.

Exactly, myself going back to HoMM, JA2 and BG is partly because I do not have to learn a new system from scratch. In JA2 1.13 I even speed things up so that I spend less time micromanage stuff and more time playing the game. At heart I enjoy micromanagement, but I just don't have the time. I am slowly comming around on Pathfinder: Kingmaker however, and starting to break through that initial layer of complexity.

 

On 7/9/2022 at 5:16 PM, GODSPEED said:

I love simcity okay!?

Have you tried Cities: Skyline? I relly like it but I often find myself get stuck with the traffic-jam problems.

 

On 7/9/2022 at 5:16 PM, GODSPEED said:

Have you thought of the Steam Deck at all?

Must confess that I haven't thought about it at all. Will check it out, thanks for the tip. 🍻

To clarify the situation. My wife has started to show some interest in video games aswell. However the games I play on my PC are just to complex for her to just pick up. She has not played any video games earlier exept a little bit of racing games so it is not really viable to sit her down and start to explain stats, buffs, range, accuracy or whatever in a game. I do not belive she is really interested in games as complex as crpgs either, togheter with all the reading often acquired. So therefore I am looking for something more in the line were you can just pick it up and play whitout much fuzz.

Or I might just buy a VR headset and get this: 😁

 

Edited by Hendrix
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On 7/13/2022 at 4:20 AM, Hendrix said:

Or I might just buy a VR headset and get this: 😁

Hahahaha! 😂


I've been debating VR for quite some time, but I would have to upgrade my video card first, RX 5700 XT isn't (in my opinion) good enough to maintain high refresh rate VR.. and well, I am finding it so hard to justify the cost of a GPU nowadays for the little gaming I do with games that are VERY demanding.

My PC upgrading and/or new build has taken a real pause because of the cost of GPU's during the covid thing. While prices have come down, here in Canada anyways, I still feel the price of cards way too high. When I bought my "Founder's Edition" RX 5700 XT, it was the same price that you can get a modern 3060 non Ti or a RX 6600 XT.

Even if those cards would be better than the one I have, they wouldn't feel 500$ worth of better, just such a tiny upgrade that well to get something that makes sense to "upgrade" I would have to spend like 800$ - 1000$ on a midrange GPU like 3070 Ti or RX 6800.

At that point, I don't know. I don't like the thought of so much money on a GPU... so VR is on hold for the moment.

I still haven't decided if I will buy the Steam Deck or not.



As for the Switch, to play some more basic video games with your wife, I think the Switch is the best console. The games are just really fun, like the party games, mario kart, sports games... they are easy and fun to get into.

If you really like turn-based tactics (like we do), then you would probably like to introduce her to Mario & Rabbids. I mean, it's pretty cute and funny and it is simple but challenging. It is different enough from new xcom in style of play, but it keeps the easy interface and gear and easy 1-2-turn style that makes it less intense for newcommers to turn-based games. It was my favorite Switch game!

I don't usually laugh THAT much at "children's" movies or games, but Mario + Rabbids was kind of funny, the rabbids faces always kind of made me giggle. It's also easily the type of thing a girl (I don't want to judge all girls, but just in "general".. stereotype I guess) would find cute and funny.

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Hey guys. 

I agree with everything you've both said, but I think that modern gamers are as much to blame for all the soulless crap that gets released these days. It's all YouTubers and Twitchers, all jumping on the meme train, all rushing for the next collectible, achievement, daily quest, whatever. None of that crap makes good gameplay.

Most modern gamers don't care about multiple choice, they care about what Google tells them is the "meta" choice. Why waste time trying to solve a puzzle or quest when they can just in instantly get all the answers on their phone. That instant gratification is what ruins things.

That impatient and soulless approach to gaming is why most modern gamers just can't handle a slower games like Fallout, Jagged Alliance, Baldur's Gate, etc. The old games haven't aged badly, it's the modern players that have aged badly, and they're now the ones developing the games. It's the same with modern music and movies.

There are still some decent games these days, but they they always seem less willing to take chances like the older ones did. And who can blame them when everyone these days is so easily offended.

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  • 4 weeks later...

I don't know how to feel about the new trailer.

Parts of it look promising; like the map design and the weapon customization.

Yet, I feel somewhat underwhelmed with the gameplay and UI. Not sure if the gun sounds are "final", but they all sounded the same.



Maybe I'm just being difficult? As much as I try to be fair and see both sides of the coin, part of me can't help but feel that when this game releases, I won't feel it is JAGGED ALLIANCE.. simply an Xcom clone with a new skin and a few tweaks.

My 2 biggest points of contention from the trailer:

1. Clunky and slow UI with your cursor locked on the enemy and having to click choices before shooting


That feels like a HUGE downgrade from a game that released in 1999. Simply mouse over the body part, right click to aim, left click to shoot. I'm surprised they haven't simply tried to make that possible in the new game. For PC, as visually easier system like having the body part highlighted to make it visible, like if you point your pointer over the arm, or the head or the torso, or the legs, that body part will highlight in red, and the person your cursor is aiming at would be in highlighted in white or something.

For console, simply use the R/L or a joystick to "tab" between body parts.

Anyways, REALLY not a fan of the UI. Back when JA2 was released, we still used 4:3 monitors for a long time. Now that we have so much wider monitors, I would have expected top and bottom to be clear of UI, and put the icons and merc portraits on the right or left edges with a sliding menu to set semi/burst/auto mode and other stance-related settings. My keyboard also has enough keys to have so many shortcuts.. as I do with JA2 since... well.. 1999.

2. Overwatch

It simply has no place in this game. I know many Xcom players will like it.. I really hate it. Has no place in Jagged Alliance.

JA has a perfect system that scales with the level and experience of the individual merc. Try getting Flo to interrupt an enemy. Nope. She's just not good enough for that, so you won't put her in a situation where she would be the one to interrupt. On top of that, if in the event she would get one... would she even be able to hit her target? 🤣

 

 

For the moment, this is all I will say about it, as there is so much from the trailer that to me feels like a trailer; snippets of gameplay that only shows fractions of what I would hope it is. And then again, maybe this is all I should expect?


Sorry to sound like a downer.


 

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23 minutes ago, GODSPEED said:

I don't know how to feel about the new trailer.

Parts of it look promising; like the map design and the weapon customization.

Yet, I feel somewhat underwhelmed with the gameplay and UI. Not sure if the gun sounds are "final", but they all sounded the same.



Maybe I'm just being difficult? As much as I try to be fair and see both sides of the coin, part of me can't help but feel that when this game releases, I won't feel it is JAGGED ALLIANCE.. simply an Xcom clone with a new skin and a few tweaks.

My 2 biggest points of contention from the trailer:

1. Clunky and slow UI with your cursor locked on the enemy and having to click choices before shooting


That feels like a HUGE downgrade from a game that released in 1999. Simply mouse over the body part, right click to aim, left click to shoot. I'm surprised they haven't simply tried to make that possible in the new game. For PC, as visually easier system like having the body part highlighted to make it visible, like if you point your pointer over the arm, or the head or the torso, or the legs, that body part will highlight in red, and the person your cursor is aiming at would be in highlighted in white or something.

For console, simply use the R/L or a joystick to "tab" between body parts.

Anyways, REALLY not a fan of the UI. Back when JA2 was released, we still used 4:3 monitors for a long time. Now that we have so much wider monitors, I would have expected top and bottom to be clear of UI, and put the icons and merc portraits on the right or left edges with a sliding menu to set semi/burst/auto mode and other stance-related settings. My keyboard also has enough keys to have so many shortcuts.. as I do with JA2 since... well.. 1999.

2. Overwatch

It simply has no place in this game. I know many Xcom players will like it.. I really hate it. Has no place in Jagged Alliance.

JA has a perfect system that scales with the level and experience of the individual merc. Try getting Flo to interrupt an enemy. Nope. She's just not good enough for that, so you won't put her in a situation where she would be the one to interrupt. On top of that, if in the event she would get one... would she even be able to hit her target? 🤣

 

 

For the moment, this is all I will say about it, as there is so much from the trailer that to me feels like a trailer; snippets of gameplay that only shows fractions of what I would hope it is. And then again, maybe this is all I should expect?


Sorry to sound like a downer.


 

I would kinda disagree with both parts.

To me this system looks more intuitive and also seems to be more standardized. And Standard isn't always bad. Imagine you still had games with controls like in System Shock 1. Or WASD not usable. You can also argue that shooting at Arms/Hands is one of the most important options, a level of detail not possible in JA2.

The Interrupt System in Jagged Alliance 2 works well, but I think it's so complicated that only a fraction of even the veterans fully max it out.

If you have someone in the building, possibly aiming at a window, you'd need to do the following:
-Possibly make a nose close to another part of the room. No idea if that does anything, but maybe the enemy will then look or move to that direction
-Sneak with your character next to the window or (open) door.
-Turn your character so that he/she looks against the wall
-Press ALT, which turns normal movement into sidestep (unless I think you are not standing, which causes different behaviour), and then move sidewards towards the window
-At this point the interrupt is calculated. If you made no noise and sidestep, seeing the enemy at the same time, you didnt give any chances anway. If the enemy kept looking at the window, its down to your Levels (and maybe Wisdom, not sure) which determines whether or not the enemy gets an interrupt.

And in addition, on interrupts it can also happen that:
-If you miss your interrupt shot, you might cause the interrupt to cancel, you never really know
-Your interrupt shot might have highlighted your character to a new enemy. This can cause an interrupt within an interrupt

I think that system is super complex and complicated, and the additional complexity doesnt add that much over an Overwatch mechanic, which is much simpler to understand and execute.

In addition, note, that this overwatch differs in several ways to XCom overwatch:
1. Overwatch can be setup in realtime, outside of combat and be used to interrupt first enemy movemet
2. You can decide the direction of your overwatch
3. You can decide the length of the cone of your overwatch
4. You can decide how many points you want to use in your interrupt, giving you up to 3 attacks

You might even argue that overwatch is more realistic, as this is more of a reaction. So on overwatch you can only shoot on that target and not freely run around.

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@Hendrix

Welp... I think it started. You see that post someone put about having a "commie" Ivan on the cover&


😑


You know, I take the time to share my opinion about the game and what I want, with maybe a little more blunt force than expected. I'll argue my case and opinions because I feel others here understand the fact that there are things we want for JA3. Each in our own way.

I have to say though, I was quite surprised to see the amount of comments in that SJW post. Those types of posts, just my opinion, are best left empty. The best way those Social Justice Warriors have to stir up crap is to post comments and then everyone jumps in and well.. what better way to gain traction?

It is like arguing with a troll. If no one answered, they'd be left alone with their sh!t and well.. would get bored. But the fact others answer and defend something, gives them and others fuel to keep on doing this kind of crap.

It takes one to start it and eventually another joins the fray..

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11 hours ago, Kordanor said:

The opening post was rather bad, but I think there is a point. I don't think there is a good reason for having a hammer and sickle there, which even Ivan hasn't used before.

The only reason I'll reply to your post is because I respect you, because I know you also care about Jagged Alliance.

I normally don't want to waste thought and energy in politics and modern "we have to remove [historical symbol, word, or fact] because it can affect people"!

I didn't join this forum to talk politics. I don't see ANY valid reasons to remove the Hammer and Sickle from Ivan. None! That is what cancel culture does, I want no part in it. The fact Ivan has the Hammer & Sickle on his hat gives him depth and perspective. This is, again, one of the many features that makes Jagged Alliance great, it can make remarks about culture, racism, ideologies, sexism, etc.. I WANT that in Jagged Alliance 3!

If you feel strongly about the Hammer & Sickle, then in the game, you would avoid hiring him. Having him on the cover doesn't promote anything in particular.

Have you ever heard someone complain in the past about Ivan being a communist, or the hints of him being communist?


..and I would also like to point out that the Hammer & Sickle imagery doesn't encourage hate or anything... on the contrary, Communism, as an ideology, is NOT bad at all, it's about equality. Was it handled in a bad way by some leaders who did bad things? Well yes! Just like the IDEOLOGY behind Fascism is also one that, if handled correctly, seems to be good for the people, but mishandled by power-hungry leaders.

When I play Hearts of Iron, I've often played Nazi Germany, as I've played Fascist Japan, as I've played USA, as I've played Britain, France... etc..


Cancel Culture doesn't belong in video games @Kordanor!


Where does it stop?
In JA2 he says: "No! Problem. Money. Даже не думай обмануть меня - я убью тебя, сука." (Don't even think to cheat me - I'll kill you, bitch.")

What is next? Someone will come here to say that they think it is sexist to say that b word?

Ivan JA1.png

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But you are all out against on the other front. I just want to be realistic here.
Hammer & Sickle hasn't been used by Ivan in the past. It just shows up now on the cover, why? The only good reason can be that THQ wanted to promote "This cool sowiet guy". And I do indeed think that its the wrong time for doing so.
It's not about cancel culture, SJW (which I know what it means, but from my experience the term is also mostly used by right wing extremists) to me its just common sense...dignity or whatever you want to call it.
And I am pretty certain that it will spark further discussions, and this being just such a minor thing, which as mentioned was even made up by THQ (as Ivan didnt wear the symbol in the past) being completely unnecessary adding nothing of value, it should rather be removed. The Pros just outweigh the Cons. Because...well...there are no Cons. The only "con" is that people will scream about "SJWs" and THQ try to show anticipatory obedience.

This has nothing to do about whether or not I like Ivan, I would want to hire him or whatnot.

I don't see why it's that hard to disconnect from your own perspective from within the game and try to look objectively on the game  as an outsider.

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  • 2 weeks later...

What time period is JA3 actually set in? As for when JA2 came out, it wasn't too long after the end of the Soviet Union and so a former Soviet soldier turned mercenary was plausible. If the game is going for stereotypes on some level then I guess that is where Ivan has ended up with his Hammer & Sickle badge. What do you think of when someone says Russian former soldier who is now a mercenary? To some that creates the idea of a man who fought under the Soviet Union in that stereotypical culture so often shown in Hollywood movies to this day, rightly or wrongly.

If JA3 is set today, Soviet-era soldier turned merc doesn't really fit so unless it is purely a stereotype identification, it is unnecessary to have the Hammer & Sickle. Then again, is it really necessary anyway, unless Ivan misses the "old ways"?

Given light of what is currently happening between Ukraine and Russia, even if the game is just fiction, it would be best to remove that badge. You will still know Ivan to be who he was always  meant to be without annoying people. While it might not be offensive to some, it could be to others, even when it is just artwork for a game. Lots of other things get changed (or cancelled) for less and I usually find myself sighing and tutting because it feels like everything these days is offensive. Then again, I repeat, when is JA3 set? If it is set in a historical timeline, even if only by a few decades, it should be okay as historical accuracy shouldn't be always omitted, even for a game.

It is nonetheless a tricky thing to decide in this day and age. Would the character of James Bond be created today? No, absolutely not. Drinking, originally smoking, womanising and killing bad guys. His character has already been altered a little to match the times, while still keeping him Bond-like. To some that is not far enough and they will keep complaining until the next version of Bond is a gender-fluid, transsexual, gay, black, Jewish Muslim who cares about the environment so much that nothing gets blown up.

 

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The worry isn't so much about the symbol, it is about seeing no end to what is "acceptable", then it becomes, "why is a Russian" on the cover? Why are we not showing the Ukrainian flag to show support?.. at some point, it just never ends.

In some countries, the swastika is banned from everything, so some games need to replace it with something else to make it legal.

I have no allegiance or love for the third reich, but it doesn't change that if I play a video game with any kind of historical nature (realistic, alternate history or fiction), please show me the symbols, regardless of the country.

Showing a hammer and sickle on a hat has nothing to do with anything modern. Back in the 2000's it was actually quite popular to see people wearing CCCP, USSR, Che Guevera and Soviet emblems on shirts and clothing.. actually very common to see that here in Canada. While working at my last job, dealing with artwork and all, many clients collected soviet era propaganda and artwork for its striking and artistic nature.

I just find it sad that one person mentions a topic that a guy on the cover is wearing a soviet emblem and this is associated with modern things... when there is no relation whatsoever.. and suddenly, things need to change.

For once, it is actually refreshing to see a company not trying to bend the knee to whatever little complaint someone has.

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I am quite broad minded myself and I can put things in context. Then again, I consider myself fortunate that I have never been oppressed by a government, never lived in a dictatorship or where you might get picked up by secret police, and in my lifetime, have never experienced my country being invaded.

Had I been in any of those situations, would I be as broad minded? I can totally understand the swastika being banned in Germany. I prefer to see it in something historical but I can live with  a flag in a game or film that looks similar, such as their war flag and then replacing the swastika with their balkenkreuz. It still seems weird today, seeing the swastika proudly displayed in East Asia because of Nazi history, even though for East Asians it has a completely different history.

The days of the Soviet Union is looked upon fondly by many that lived through it, regardless of its bad side. There is room for romanticism and fascination of that period of Eastern Europe. Despite my great interest in military history, you can't fondly look at what the Nazis built in the same way, with the exception of the military technology that came about.

As for seeing things like Ché Guevara and CCCP fashion statements in the 2000s, I remember seeing plenty of that in the early to mid 90s when I was in the later years of school and college. Ché posters and shirts always baffled me when being displayed by teenagers from the United Kingdom but Soviet stylings I could always "get".

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