Multiplayer

[JaggedMerc]

Any info on how exactly the Multiplayer will be? Will it be crossplay (will GoG players be able to play with Steam players)? And wich modes will be available for multiplayer? Will it be PvP, Coop, PvPvE?

[Solaris_Wave]

I read in the latest PC Gamer magazine that co-op is supposedly good fun. During the real-time phase of battle, the chance for two people to handle groups that are split up is supposed to lead to an enjoyable working of tactics. Sadly, not too much was covered about multiplayer in the published preview. Therefore, I don't know how co-op is handled (who controls what) or whether there are any other modes.

[DonBilbo]

In a dev stream they stated that they will probably do a dev diary about coop later on. 

[ShadowMagic]

How many peeps in here will actually make use of COOP? Any of you guys play JA together with friends or relatives or in some active TS/Vent or (gayish) Discord channels?

[DonBilbo]

What do you have against coop? There are already so little that support that function in TBS genre. I like to play coop with a friend as we did with DOS, DOS2, Wasteland 3 and soon BG3 and JA3. I don’t think the coop feature of the mentioned games made them any worse.

And why is some gay by using a software? What about the women who use it? That’s really intellectually undemanding and doesn’t help the discussion. If you don’t use it, so be it. Why don’t let others have fun with it?

[DougS2K]

I have zero interest in multiplayer, and I mean zero. The gaming market is flooded with multiplayer/co-op games already and I think it just takes time and resources away from making this game even better.

That being said, I am curious how this will work in JA3. I don't get the attraction for co-op in this style of game but I'm sure it will make some people happy and they'll enjoy it. Would have liked to have seen that time and effort go into something else though.

[Lunokhod]

26 minutes ago, DougS2K said:

I think it just takes time and resources away from making this game even better.

100%

[scope112]

I want a PvP mode like we had in Deadly Games. That would interest me much more than Co-Op mode.

 

What is more fun than assembling your own mercenary teams and battling it out against your friend?

[DonBilbo]

3 hours ago, DougS2K said:

Would have liked to have seen that time and effort go into something else though.

That’s usually not the way game development works (maybe with the exception of very small teams where everyone does several different things/all). In bigger teams everyone has a specific role. They probably hired one or several people to implement multiplayer/coop functionality in their games (I am not familiar with their previous games and if they have multiplayer/coop). Telling these people to not do coop but to invest their time in asset creation or design gameplay mechanics would probably not make for a better game. You’d hire more people specifically with expertise in this field if you want expand or schedule more time for the existing team to implement more.

You don’t tell a cook he is a car mechanic now 😉

Edited June 9 by DonBilbo

[DougS2K]

18 hours ago, DonBilbo said:

That’s usually not the way game development works (maybe with the exception of very small teams where everyone does several different things/all). In bigger teams everyone has a specific role. They probably hired one or several people to implement multiplayer/coop functionality in their games (I am not familiar with their previous games and if they have multiplayer/coop). Telling these people to not do coop but to invest their time in asset creation or design gameplay mechanics would probably not make for a better game. You’d hire more people specifically with expertise in this field if you want expand or schedule more time for the existing team to implement more.

You don’t tell a cook he is a car mechanic now 😉

I hear arguments like this all the time but they always miss the point.

Ok, say they hired two guys just to work on the multiplayer part of the game and for the sake of argument, let's say the rest of the game is worked on by 6 guys (I'm just picking numbers at random here). So sure, those two multiplayer guys couldn't have contributed to the rest of the game since that's not their "specialty". However, if they weren't hired to implement multiplayer, that would have freed up money and time to hire 2 more guys to work on the rest of the game. So you would have 8 guys working on the game instead of 6.

[OgreCommander]

From what I've seen in recent years from similar games i.e. Wasteland 3, DOS 1&2, and BG3.  The multiplayer hasn't diminished the single player experience, with the exception of not having having all the companions available (meaning that another player usually takes a spot away from a companion).  Wasteland 3 just gave you another group, which is how I see JA3's co-op happening.  Each player controls a squad of mercs.  PvP wouldn't keep my attention for very long, so I personally wouldn't want that as the only MP mode (I think it would be similar to XCOM 2's multiplayer which I didn't find that fun).  But that doesn't mean you have to play the same way in co-op; Wasteland 3 allowed the party to disagree with each other, and even start rumors about the other squad.  Allowing the squads to work independently of one another, except for a few key battles where both are required could be interesting.  Well that's my two cents.

[JaggedMerc]

Multiplayer (and specially with crossplay, nowadays) is one of the best things to keep a game selling over the years. A strong community is either built by heavy modding capabilities or multiplayer (or both!) You can see 5, 10 years old games with a very active community exactly because they are multiplayer. I'm not saying this would be the case for JA3, but it happens. As to the development discussion, never saw any great game turning into a terrible game just because the developers spent some time/money implementing multiplayer...that's a so absolutely amateur, naive and shallow thinking. Multiplayer or not is simply a design decision. We're not talking about those micro-indie "one-guy programming from it's basement" "companies".

[DonBilbo]

3 hours ago, OgreCommander said:

From what I've seen in recent years from similar games i.e. Wasteland 3, DOS 1&2, and BG3.  The multiplayer hasn't diminished the single player experience, with the exception of not having having all the companions available (meaning that another player usually takes a spot away from a companion).  Wasteland 3 just gave you another group, which is how I see JA3's co-op happening.  Each player controls a squad of mercs.  PvP wouldn't keep my attention for very long, so I personally wouldn't want that as the only MP mode (I think it would be similar to XCOM 2's multiplayer which I didn't find that fun).  But that doesn't mean you have to play the same way in co-op; Wasteland 3 allowed the party to disagree with each other, and even start rumors about the other squad.  Allowing the squads to work independently of one another, except for a few key battles where both are required could be interesting.  Well that's my two cents.

I am curious to see how they handle coop. Will they allow to create 2 IMP characters so both can play as themselves? Will it even be possible to play coop with more than 2 players? Can player control members of the same squad or does every player need to make his own squad? So many questions. I am looking forward to get more info on coop in the upcoming weeks.

[OgreCommander]

On 6/10/2023 at 10:55 PM, DonBilbo said:

I am curious to see how they handle coop. Will they allow to create 2 IMP characters so both can play as themselves? Will it even be possible to play coop with more than 2 players? Can player control members of the same squad or does every player need to make his own squad? So many questions. I am looking forward to get more info on coop in the upcoming weeks.

I agree, I have a buddy that I usually play these types of games with (also beat Wasteland 3 with said buddy).  It would be nice to play w/ more than two, but I expect it will only be two.  However I've been proven wrong before, and hope so again.  With similarities to Wasteland each player controlling starting with a single team seems the most logical to me.

Edited June 28 by OgreCommander

[bp_968]

On 6/9/2023 at 2:04 PM, DougS2K said:

I have zero interest in multiplayer, and I mean zero. The gaming market is flooded with multiplayer/co-op games already and I think it just takes time and resources away from making this game even better.

That being said, I am curious how this will work in JA3. I don't get the attraction for co-op in this style of game but I'm sure it will make some people happy and they'll enjoy it. Would have liked to have seen that time and effort go into something else though.

Some of my best JA memories was playing MP with my uncle and setting up hilarious scenarios like a fully outfitted Mike versus an entire squad of newbies.  (The trick was to use stun grenades on him until he goes down and stand around him and endlessly dump bullets into him on the ground).

I'm super excited about Coop in JA3. A friend and myself already have our calendars marked for starting a play through on day one.

With the right friends co-op makes nearly every game *better*.  Devs are including coop in more games now because there is a lot of demand for the feature.  

I'm sorry you don't have the right friends to make coop fun for you but it really is a blast with the right people.  But it really needs to be the *right* people.  If you don't have playstyles that work well together it will kill the fun.

[D13]

I haven't made up my mind on coop because I too have never met anyone who enjoyed JA enough to make an entire coop campaign viable. 😢

But single-sector PvP is something I would definitely enjoy. With single-sector there's not much of an investment so it could be played spontaneously, and with total strangers. Most importantly, it would expose players to entirely new tactical challenges.

[DougS2K]

9 hours ago, bp_968 said:

Some of my best JA memories was playing MP with my uncle and setting up hilarious scenarios like a fully outfitted Mike versus an entire squad of newbies.  (The trick was to use stun grenades on him until he goes down and stand around him and endlessly dump bullets into him on the ground).

I'm super excited about Coop in JA3. A friend and myself already have our calendars marked for starting a play through on day one.

With the right friends co-op makes nearly every game *better*.  Devs are including coop in more games now because there is a lot of demand for the feature.  

I'm sorry you don't have the right friends to make coop fun for you but it really is a blast with the right people.  But it really needs to be the *right* people.  If you don't have playstyles that work well together it will kill the fun.

It's not that I don't have the right friends, it's more that I just prefer to play games alone. I used to play a lot of multi-player FPS games back in the day but I don't feel like listening to annoying loud mouths spewing garbage or racist shit anymore. 😄

When I game it gives me a chance to just chill and do things at my own pace, come and go as I please, and I have no obligiation to talk to anyone unless the wifey needs me for something. A lot of times I'll fire up a chill game, throw on a podcast or documentary in the background and just zone out. Probably has a lot to do with me getting older as well. Quite relaxing though I must say.

Recently been playing another Haemimont game while I wait for JA3 called Stranded Alien Dawn. Enjoying it and it's soaking up a lot of hours while we all wait for the JA3 release.

[pit]

IMO MP (especially Pvp) adds nothing to a game like that - sure you could say "Uh oh, those 2 or 3 times 5 to 10 minutes of hillarious single sector pvp where sooo fun" but would the "potential" of a couple minutes PvP fun really be the only reason why you bought the game?

If yes that sounds to me like the recipe for disappointment. Not to mention the pvp-related "balancing" patches that impact the main part of the game usually very negatively - you know, that part thats the reason for the majority to buy the game.

 

I can not even see the use/need/fun for coop bc its a turn based game, at least after the opening salvo/shot.

 

Kinda sidenote rant inc:

Its sad, i was initially (around two weeks ago) very excited to hear about JA3 - and its coming very soon too.

So excited so that i really thought about preordering it for 2 or 3 minutes (which is against everything i've learned in the past 8-10 years (and its getting worse every year (watch out for Starfield xD))).

But now, after a little research i found out that there are *coff* "streamlined" (much less) mercs (in a game with perma death where you can have very bad luck xD), weapon stats that make no sense, weapon mods that make even less sense (like only giving a bonus to one very specific use case) in addition (not sure about that) it seems Bobby Ray's is gone - you now have to craft ammo instead and on top of that there is MP which, as already mentioned, means usually nothing good for a SP game.

(By the way: the statements about how many sectors there are (in between the lines: "to conquer") counting in the sea tiles which are irrelevant leaves a bad taste in my mouth too ^^)

 

And: No MP is rarely (if ever at all - can you name one?) a reason for a primarily SP game to ensure a long lifespan - you know what is? An active modding community!

 

The more i read the more i come to the conclusion that this game will be a disappointment like every other JA ripoff since JA2 - at least for me, i thought it will be an true Jagged Alliance and not what it, from what i could see so far, seems to be ... an reimagined streamlined kinda but not really JA thingie.

I think I'll keep an ey on it but give it a pass until i see what mods can do.

I would have judged it more neutral if it would'nt be named JA3 - bc that in addition with how the devs painted it and what i found out about it made it smell like "lets milk the nostalgics first and see how it goes overall".

Could (and would like to) be wrong about it but thats how it presents it self to me. ;(

 

Sry for both, my bad english and the "offroad" part.

[OgreCommander]

Until we get confirmation from the devs, and there's no point in complaining about features that don't exist (as far as we are aware of) yet.  Yeah I've enjoyed the stream of recent co-op games that have appeared; I would be very happy if JA3 continued that thread, but maybe they're thinking that a merc-off experience might be more entertaining.  For me if they did something like this it wouldn't be as fun, though if the players acted closer to competing agencies.  Maybe the players are trying to complete the same goals, but their employer will only pay one group.  Include the option to work for the baddies, include factional local mercs (this exists somewhat already with the planned game).  Hire a merc out from under the other group.  Now that might interesting.  To be honest the feature I am looking forward to the most is I.M.P. it's what made me play JA2 and enjoy all the other mercs I hired.

[ShadowMagic]

Let them complete the base game and rework the Mercs first before going into co-op. There is still so many basic features missing or under developed co-op should be on the bottom of their to-do list if you ask me.

 

[Lunokhod]

58 minutes ago, OgreCommander said:

To be honest the feature I am looking forward to the most is I.M.P. it's what made me play JA2 and enjoy all the other mercs I hired.

So without IMP u cant enjoy other mercs and game? Interesting. I would prefer that all IMP characters become RPC's, so u could hire more people.

[OgreCommander]

4 minutes ago, Lunokhod said:

So without IMP u cant enjoy other mercs and game? Interesting. I would prefer that all IMP characters become RPC's, so u could hire more people.

I wasn't invested in the first Jagged Alliance, hell I still haven't beaten it.  The IMP character gave me a character to focus on, and enjoy the other merc's various personalities.  So I played through the campaign multiple times, even beating it on occasion.  I know the IMP character isn't necessarily important to the story, but I enjoyed it.  It worked for me.  Though I can agree with you about making them RPCs, it was expensive way to decide play style of one merc.

[Warmonger]

Suggesting a drop-in option, mean one should able to join on the Legion-side to grab a solider there and lead it against the attacking Gamer. We had this in the Total War series. It was called dropp-in-battles there.  

 

Edited July 7 by Warmonger

[FRIEDL]

I think it is a good idea to go step by step with mp features. It is technically complex and we do not want a buggy desync mess like Ja2 was in MP. 2P coop is great for a start. Lets see how it goes and hope for a future mp extension update!!!

Edited July 9 by FRIEDL

[YourDaddyIsShoes]

On 6/9/2023 at 12:45 PM, DonBilbo said:

What do you have against coop? There are already so little that support that function in TBS genre. I like to play coop with a friend as we did with DOS, DOS2, Wasteland 3 and soon BG3 and JA3. I don’t think the coop feature of the mentioned games made them any worse.

And why is some gay by using a software? What about the women who use it? That’s really intellectually undemanding and doesn’t help the discussion. If you don’t use it, so be it. Why don’t let others have fun with it?

Nice reply. I agree with you 100% here. Nothing quite like pulling off a W out of thin air a CunnyHairs width from a total squad wipe because you and your zero attention span fps reskin or sports game playing friend finally start to click and Hit a new level of strategy and tactics that you simply can't recreate in other types of games in any other mode either. TBT games with multi player Co-oP are super slept on. 

 

I play tons of single player games but being able to share something i love doing with a good friend is absolutely hands down and infinite X more rewarding and enjoyable in the end. That is unless you're so A-social or even Antisocial that you just have no clue how to be an actual person or can't even life right.

 

Therefore I would like to speak to all the solo dolo Dicks that always act like we're insane for wanting to enjoy a good game with an actual friend... but thats how games are meant to be played to the core of their very existence... 

 

So kindly Eff-off

sincerely,

people who have friends n sh*&...

 

 

P.S. I almost always play the video games I enjoy as single player so when an amazing chance to have a great experience in the best genre in all of gaming comes along, I embrace it. Eveyone needs to or they should probably get a mental health screening. especially since their OPINION and bad attitude are forced on us as if they are even close to being correct... Sad Simps.

 

 

P.P.S. Not to be devils advocate but I have to mention to you tho, women can be GAY too...  It's sometimes hard for me to rally behind a comment I completely agree with when the commenter says shit thats so ignorant and closed minded that its on the verge of being rude to both women and gays at the same time. lmfao... so hey we're not all perfect... actually none of us are. so I do hope the sadfuk without friends and the shit attitude gets a friend someday and I hope you start become aware of the ignorant things you say about people who are in the throes of the touchy subject crowds as of late... 

 

Like i said, I agree with you 100% besides when you asked how it makes people gay by using a software... what about the women... yada yada boolshite... cuz Women can also be gay, don't exclude people... Not when its about gaming in any sense... except denuvo, their entire trashcan staff and anyone who supports them for invading our private space and our PCs and lives by taking ownership of things we purchaseed from us and acting greedy. They cried about 90-97% sales losses via piracy without DRMs and then with them and especially Denuvo, they havent had any change in sales numbers as opposed to before during the days when pirates took away their livelyhoods...

They can be excluded... From gaming. 

 

Other than those doucheknuckles gaming is for everyone, So be mindful of your own ignorance, even when its meant to defend, it can come across as something completley opposite.

 

PEACE n Sailin the Seas!!!