Just finished the game on the highest difficulties, few thoughts

[Chris Xia]

(no spoiler)

English is not my first language, sorry in advance.

 

Just finished the game in ironman & highest difficulties, streamed on Douyu (a Chinese platform) the entire process.

Uploading the ending video to Bilibili as I am writing this feedback to the devs. After this I am going to dive into Xenonauts 2 and then Diablo 4 new season starts...I will comeback to JA3 after Baulders gate 3 for sure...(what a good year for gamers)

There are lots of people I didn't save, lot of puzzles left unsolved.

 

Overall I wanna say, as a JA veteran from the very begining, I didn't expect you guys can make a game that meets my lowest standard, I pre ordered game only because I saw Ian Currie's name in the trailer.

Somehow this game is much better than expected, I don't think it gets to JA2 level yet, but there are few wrongs but so many rights.

I am recommending this game to all of my friends, it's brilliant.

 

Ok...enough kissing...here are my thoughts, negatives first.

Things that are missing...

 

1. it's no longer a relatively realistic tactical simulation.

(I have to emphasize, it doesn't mean the game is not fun)

Despite having much more vertical space, JA3 tactical map is too small. I don't think mod can fix that and I understand making larger map will cost you guys a lot more.

But as a result of small tactical map, you often have some ridculous amount of CQC, even in few side missions despite have choices to avoid battle, but you often end up in a situation where 10-20 soliders holding heavy rifles stand next to each other face to face and having a shoot out...and you know the result...my guys came out with some small wounds but these bullet proof juggernauts are not like those humans in JA2.

This game's fighting is getting way too "Xcom" than JA2.

To be fair, there are moments where I feel the game enabled me to do some real military style tactics, but it't overshadowed by too many "not real moments"

The realsim is mostly gone, except those moments, in the dark, in the rain, you see the incoming bullets bounce off the walls...me like those...

 

I am not saying the fights are not enjoyable, they are, but JA2 is not Xcom, maybe Xcom style of gaming appeals more (newer) audience...But I am not coming from a sales perspective, as a die hard fan, in 3-5 years, if you were to make a Jagged Alliance 4, the frist thing I want to change will be tactical map size. Give us more room and more realism, and larger and longer fights.

 

You can't just make it easier for players to send level 9 highly armoured man running 10 blocks over all the fences with a heavy machine gun and shoot enemy in the face.

In my end game, I decided to spend all my millions of dollars and fill the map with 4 of my squads, I am completely out gun (literally, i have more people than the boss)the final villian...I blame this to the tactical map size.

You can't have 50 enemies within that map size...

 

Also...

I don't like you took out the stamina bar way, My Igor Dorvich is running like Usain Bolt with full heavy armour, two guns ready to use, and a mortar and a rocket launcher in the backpack.

That is also why I don't like to tear apart weapons for parts and magically making all sorts of attachments for guns out of "parts" you find on burned cars.

All these system is fun and easy to understand, I enjoy playing, it's easy and painless.

But it took the realsim away piece by piece.

 

Plus, other than stealth kills, even I have no enemies in sight for 1000 turns, you still won't switch back to real time.

That is frustrating in quite a few maps where there are plenty rooms (say, that Jail where you get your AA-12 is a good example)

The game just dosen't allow you to go back to real time.

I guess that will be fixed by some mod later on.

 

and finally, other than guns, why can't I see the armour changes on my characters? This is the part where you should learn from Xcom...allow colour custimization, actually, with good voice acting and slightly different character modelling, I don't even need colour custimization.

I am just happeir to see the sexy fox came in with some holiday clothes and ended up with full tactical gear, some heavy plated amour that actually also have that bullet bounce off effect (how cool would that be)

 

To be honest, if you were to make JA4, I want the game to be even more realistic, featuring food and water. What that kind of resource management can enable, I will leave other player to imagine.

 

 

2. Vehicles

3. MOARE Mercenaries

May be I'm too greedy, but coming from JA2, JA3 roster feels too small.

But I guess that ok, just make a DLC...please

 

4. A good difficulty curve

Early in the game, resouces are lacking, so not enough money leads to not enough man power.

Game won't allow you to go out and hunt ...you can't sell crocdile teeth or leather.

Buying in the flea market is possible but a bit redundant (may be the books and medicine is needed but that's that)

But as game progress, you have your steady 6-12 man team, map has been cleaned off.

You have a million dollar to spend, but what can you buy other than more expnesive mercenaries?

Pretty much nothing.

You can't buy M82A1 from a website or a flea market.

Good loot all from solving map puzzles or missions.

You have all the resouces in the world, but enemy actually gets weaker, they have less outpost to launch attack.

Soliders wear same amount of amour which I am disspointted if my 100 marksmanship guy can't 1 shot them from far with a M24.

There aren't tanks holding the critical locations.

There aren't elite (well...there are some, but I can't feel the difference) swarming you in larger volumes.

If you can finish about 20 heavy armoured enemies in a tactical map, this game is pretty much over to you, because from now on that represents the highest challenge in the game.

The only difference will be enemies may have better vantage point in certain maps.

 

5. UI...

may be I am just plain stupid, I finish the game, but i sitll don't know how to multi select 4 squads and let them go to one location at the same time.

Or...may be you guys fxxked up on UI.

 

 

That's about all my issues with the game that I can remember for now.

 

 

The good things...

I like how cities have a short intro cinematics.

I love boss fights (though it can be improved)

I love you preserve the characters, humour, when I see certain character from certain previous entry of the series and game allows you to select one of my all time favourite quote, I was beyond happy.

I said few times above, but I love that bullet bounces off the wall effects, (but then agian, I am not happy with how night fights are represented, I don't see the usefulness of flare, I never used night vision goggles...)

Music is good, I love the story (but should have an Sci-fi option and a realistic opiton like JA2)

I love the XEP625 password

I love the entire vibe of the game, I can't pin point one thing, but it does bring that JA2 feeling back.

It's not there yet, but JA2 I think was at the top of this sub genre.

I want to thank the Devs actually made this enjoyable game, this can be a instant classic strategy game if it's not called Jagged Alliance.

With the JA name, the expectation is sky high, because JA2 is pretty much the GOAT in this sub genre.

But JA3 get pretty close.

It's a good trend, please devs, you will make some good money out of this game, please go do your holidays and stuff, quickly come back to the studio, make your quick buck on the DLCs, go make the fourth one.

 

 

Edited July 18, 2023 by Chris Xia

[Warmonger]

First of all my condolences that you are already through. I wouldn't dream of playing through it so quickly.

Then to YES2. Yes, I've also played through it dozens of times, but I won't touch it again after JA3, because JA3 only contains improvements, apart from certain charismatic deficits and little bugs and balances which for sure will be fixed soon. JA3's AI in particular is quite a bit better, albeit similar to outwitting as JA2's, cue run up. Sure, we're all attached to JA2; but not compulsively and JA3 can and will still develop, although it has already arrived.

[GODSPEED]

45 minutes ago, Chris Xia said:

Overall I wanna say, as a JA veteran from the very begining, I didn't expect you guys can make a game that meets my lowest standard, I pre ordered game only because I saw Ian Currie's name in the trailer.

Somehow this game is much better than expected, I don't think it gets to JA2 level yet, but there are few wrongs but so many rights.

+1

You've written a very well balanced review. I agree very much with most of your views here!

 

56 minutes ago, Chris Xia said:

and finally, other than guns, why can't I see the armour changes on my characters? This is the part where you should learn from Xcom...allow colour custimization, actually, with good voice acting and slightly different character modelling, I don't even need colour custimization.

I think this is the only point where I disagree.

In JA 1 & 2 you only had unique portraits, but everything else was very generic and same as even the npcs (just colour difference).

I also thought I was going to REALLY HATE the new merc looks.. but to be honest, after a few hours of playing... I love the choice they made! I think this is also something that has controlled how many mercs they had to choose to create. Having such unique looking 3d models means it was surely way more work to create the mercs that if they were simple models without defined features.

I know this is not the popular idea, but I really like the choice! I feel it fits with the idea that mercs in JA are unique, instead of generic like XCom. XCom needs colours because they are all the same clones.. 🤣

 

1 hour ago, Chris Xia said:

I want to thank the Devs actually made this enjoyable game, this can be a instant classic strategy game if it's not called Jagged Alliance.

With the JA name, the expectation is sky high, because JA2 is pretty much the GOAT in this sub genre.

But JA3 get pretty close.

It's a good trend, please devs, you will make some good money out of this game, please go do your holidays and stuff, quickly come back to the studio, make your quick buck on the DLCs, go make the fourth one.

+1 that ^


At least we can always play a second time to experience different mercs and choices..

..and then we can go back to 1.13 and wait for JA3.5 🤣

[Tzg]

I agree with the @Chris Xia and @GODSPEED in principle. 
 

Like @GODSPEED I love the look of the mercs I hope it will stay. 
 

I disagree with this not being JA it totally is. It’s great and how successor to JA and JA 2 should look like. Yes it isn’t in line with 1.13 - but for me at least - isn’t real JA it expands on it towards realism and better tactical game but kills its soul in the process. 
 

Yes it isn’t perfect but it is great. 
Le Roi Est Mort, Vive le Roi! 

Edited July 18, 2023 by Tzg

[Raeven]

Ok I have to say , after playing last night, some of the maps in this game are *enormous* compared to JA2. When I stumbled into my first large scale one my jaw just about dropped. They're absolutely massive. I know it's not all of them but the big maps are *very* big.

[LoboNocturno]

@Chris Xia WOW finished already within 5 days and in the hardest difficulty, congratulations. Guess it will take me a few weeks to finish it on commando.

 

But i do agree with most of your thoughts about the game. Maybe for the newer audience that doesnt know Jagged Alliance, they are fine with those colourful Fortnite art but in my honest opinion Jagged Alliance should be more realistic, darker and simply more gruesome. Yes the maps are nicely designed but too small for sure, that is a reason why most of the maps are like 10 enemies, once you have in a sector 20 enemies its like the insect fights where they put to a aquarium a centipede, tarantula, killer hornet, scorpion all together lol. 

 

If they make later on a Jagged Alliance 3.5 or 4, it should most definitely have bigger maps and the AI of the enemies should be improved, back in JA2 it was not very different either, once the enemies notice you they will just bull rush you. The enemies should try to flank us, also try to hide sometimes in a corner or building to ambush us suddenly, or once we cleaned almost the whole squad the few wounded survivors should try to escape (they were doing it sometimes in JA2).

 

The gear should also appear like back in Jagged Alliance RAGE, those small details brings much more realism and fun into the game. 

 

 

[Tzg]

Just now, LoboNocturno said:

@Chris Xia WOW finished already within 5 days and in the hardest difficulty, congratulations. Guess it will take me a few weeks to finish it on commando.

 

But i do agree with most of your thoughts about the game. Maybe for the newer audience that doesnt know Jagged Alliance, they are fine with those colourful Fortnite art but in my honest opinion Jagged Alliance should be more realistic, darker and simply more gruesome. Yes the maps are nicely designed but too small for sure, that is a reason why most of the maps are like 10 enemies, once you have in a sector 20 enemies its like the insect fights where they put to a aquarium a centipede, tarantula, killer hornet, scorpion all together lol. 

 

You must have been playing different Jagged Alliance. Definitely not dark and gruesome- as it was with proper 80s and 90s b class action movies - colourful characters and cheesy lines are must. As for gear yeah some can be displayed - but I don’t want to have bunch of mercs all lookig like space marines from chaos gate. Ok as it is. And if you want to opt dress up - play Diablo 4. 
this is not and never been a serious tactical milsim game. 

[Warmonger]

After a little more xp with the game, I assume that you are either a super nerd who neither eats, drinks and sleeps or is just crazy. You can't get through the game at the highest level in five days or so. The game is too complex for. I'm sorry mate but it is rubbish you are telling us here as I meanwhile found out by own xp with the game. And if you are cheating/easy-moder you are in the wrong place here anyway. 😡

[sandman25dcsss]

1 hour ago, Warmonger said:

After a little more xp with the game, I assume that you are either a super nerd who neither eats, drinks and sleeps or is just crazy. You can't get through the game at the highest level in five days or so. The game is too complex for. I'm sorry mate but it is rubbish you are telling us here as I meanwhile found out by own xp with the game. And if you are cheating/easy-moder you are in the wrong place here anyway. 😡

Why not? You probably missed it is his job to play games. 8 hours per day, 5 days, 40 hours.

[Warmonger]

1 hour ago, sandman25dcsss said:

Why not? You probably missed it is his job to play games. 8 hours per day, 5 days, 40 hours.

Well, can be maybe. Is probably like eating tons ice-cream so that you cannot enjoy it anymore? But not my world and idea, neither for this game nor for ice cream. I right pulled out from this sector Sector L6 for example, where this jail is. No idea yet how to take it. Think one must blow it up more or less. The end-boss there  not to get with normal weapons. Alone for this jail think I will take a  day or so and for the preparation maybe a week to gather the right stuff for.

[LoboNocturno]

@Tzg Ok ok thats your opinion, but most of us think very differently in here. Yes JA2 had the 80s, 90s action movie vibes but still it was way more serious then JA3 is. There were a few flamboyant mercs and NPCs as well but just several of them, in JA3 i could count with my 2 hands how many serious mercs are, not even talking about the NPCs as %95 of them feel way too cartoony & silly.

The tactical battles were the most realistic among its own genre, we loved JA2 cause it brought us somehow realistic feeling. You are just a rookie in here, we were crying here since 2 years that they should try to make JA3 as realistic as possible and most of got disappointed as they made it too cartoony. 1 of our best members in here @WILDFIRE can explain it better to you.

We even complained how is it possible to gain weapon parts from wrecked cars, generators etc... or get medicine out of cactus trees lol, they simplified everything way too much, but guess for the Fortnite generation is a very pleasing thing.

Jagged Alliance 2 were surely not the childish game like they made it in JA3, where even the enemies (Legion) looks like clowns. 

 

Never played Diablo (too much fantasy idk) so will not play Diablo 4 either, saw Xenonauts 2 as well but didnt liked it. I dont really play any other turn based games other then Jagged Alliance (played XCOM2 last year on console as exception which was ok but nothing special imo), if there is a turn based game i would give a try its Urban Strife.

 

@sandman25dcsss I am also in around 40 hours of gameplay (though i left the game also open for the whole day, so am probably around 25 hours of gameplay) and am still trying to conquer the northern deserted area before i can move down to the southern wetlands. The game takes time for sure (also repeating some sectors at times), so who ever finished it in the highest difficulty within 4 to 5 days, my hat goes off. I recommend to play it on commando first as its challenging already.

[Tzg]

@LoboNocturno Yes thats true. You were crying here and whining like a little babies for over 2 years. That’s 100% true. That’s why many, many, many, many (and couple more many) fans don’t come near this forum. This part is true very true.

everything else is an opinion based on what and how you perceived this game in your heads. I am sure someone will come up with equivalent of 1.13 and will change this game to be less JA and more that and you’ll be fine. 
 

In the meantime we will play and enjoy it and will keep asking if you’d want some cheese with your w(h)ine. 
 

 

[MateKiddleton]

Ironically Biff in JA3 looks much more serious than his hilarious pictures in JA1 and 2.

[LoboNocturno]

1 hour ago, MateKiddleton said:

Ironically Biff in JA3 looks much more serious than his hilarious pictures in JA1 and 2.

Most definitely but that's 1 of the very rare examples. Biff was surely a joke merc back in JA2 with $hitty stats. Smiley calling Biff in JA3 a legendary merc "which means he got boosted his stats up in JA3???".