GODSPEED

No Way!!! <-- Sorry, couldn't help but be sarcastic (in a friendly manner). A very few characters in JA2 are what I consider over-the-top (within the context of a video game, naturally!!). Steroid, for myself is a little grating after some time. Ira never bothered me, always play with her, even after quite some time. Sure, the whole Deidranna slapping Elliot thing is a little foolish.. but that happens only a handful of times in the game and I guess the fact it happens very few times means it doesn't feel forced or overdone. Very few characters have the modern equivalent of over-the-top one-liners. Actually, if you go over most one-liners characters say in JA2, they are pretty grounded. What I mean by my initial comment, is the way modern entertainment (movies & games) seem to be filled with incessant one-liners that try to be too funny, when they really aren't. So many games now with voiced protagonists that continually say the stupidest crap, filled with characters around you that just say the stupidest crap. Most characters in JA2 aren't trying to be funny. It's usually a simple remark on something they like/dislike, often tied with a personality or trait they have. Sure a few of them oddballs are maybe a little more flamboyant than others, but even those, are far and few in between. As an example, Steroid was the one over-the-top character for myself. But in a little bit of a charming way. Wtv, I'd just make do with his Arnold impersonation. Now, what the heck did they do with him? Whatever stupid phrase he says before he's about the punch a guy (and he was never portrayed as a hand-to-hand type). Or Meltdown... she now sounds goofy as heck! I just hope they didn't give that overdone treatment to all the mercs. The humour in JA2 is very subtle, not really meant to make you laugh, but many situations will provide you with that chuckle.

^ That was my biggest fear for this 'remake'. I can take different mechanics (actually enjoyed Back in Action), art styles (I did complete Flashback 🤮). I would enjoy a game, even if many many things are changed, you WILL hear me complain. But I will give it a fair chance. The one thing I have NO patience for; characters. If I'm playing the game, and the characters all feel super cheesy, too over-the-top and too cartoon-like. It will be dead in the water for me. The things I hate most is playing and constantly hearing some really stupid one-liners that feel extremely goofy.. nope, sorry! Forced humour is a show-stopper for me.

If they are remotely close to the overdone AIM character showcase, I rather not see. Anyways, where is the fun in playing the game if you already see everything?

Watch with one eye closed. I try to analyze only what matters to me in terms of gameplay mechanics. The rest I prefer to leave it for me to discover.

Wait... did I miss something somewhere? Will we have to fight gangs of Hyenas if we stray far out into the wilderness? Man, I know just the person who would gladly buy pelts and find lucrative business in Grand Chien... 🤣 (I'm being "funny"; I don't condone harm against animals, especially not for profit or sport).

Even Back in Action still has its demo!

Co-op isn't necessarily to maximise something. It can be to simply spend time with someone else. I've played Baldur's Gate 1 & 2, Icewind Dale 1 & 2, a little bit of Baldur's Gate 3 with my brother, many times. It's much quicker and efficient to play alone... but it was fun to play with him. Same thing here. It's just fun to play with a friend or gf/bf if you can. JA2 1.13 has multiplayer. Played it a few times with others... but that wasn't co-op, more of a VS. mode. Still kind of fun to be honest.

Education goes beyond simple studies and knowledge. You might KNOW many things, maybe even have a great job and great salary. Knowing HOW and WHEN to say something to others requires a basic form of intelligence, which you seem to either TRY not to use, or simply ignore... or dare I say, lack. Just your reaction to being banned on Steam; that you want to score the game lower, insult others work and act with a demeaning attitude means you are childish; not really worth having a discussion with or listening to. As much as I can not like the direction HG has taken on this game, I don't stand for those who insult others or belittle others work. Anyone who does his job, as lowly as it may seem to YOUR eyes, brings food to their families table, and that's all that matters. You're childish view of others choices and lives is irrelevant. I don't want to exchange with a person like you who cannot even be mature about such a basic form of respect. Worry about you're own self and stop insulting others.

Glad to see the modding tools and how open you are to them. I am interested to see how the co-op plays out! Well done guys!

I personally never liked Silent Storm, X-Com (old) or Jagged Alliance's way of inventory management. They very rudimentary. They get the job done, because as many point out, it isn't a game about logistics. My favourite inventory system, straight out of the box with not tweaks or mods, was the one in 7,62mm High Calibre (and Brigade E5). It wasn't so complex like the pouch system in the later releases of 1.13 (1.13 inventory is optional and not a necessity). It was modular. So you started with just the space you could fit in your actual pockets and in your hands. You needed things like a tool belt, backpack, vest, etc.. to expand the inventory. It didn't go into so much detail to restrict you. So you could place 2 small items in a vertical mag pouch if you wanted. But you couldn't place a horizontal or too large item in that space. I was REALLY hoping JA3 was going to have this kind of thing. Way simpler than the pouch system in the "New Inventory" of 1.13, but a step above the DOS-era inventory system of JA1. I find that this kind of inventory is fitting for a military-themed game, as pouches, backpacks, vests are very standard things. Unlike Baldur's Gate 1 & 2 where you simple store stuff and later do get a bag of holding.

I guess this is me being a jerk and nitpicking again. Just to make it very clear.. I want JA3 to succeed, I'm not criticizing to hate, all the opposite... I'm hoping to be proven wrong! But, this is another one of those small details that has me scratching my head. In another topic, I was talking about the stats, and @Raeven said the stats are the same as JA2. And where I have trouble kind of believing this is over the content I've seen so far, it either doesn't appear that way, or I'm not understanding something. Every action a merc took was attached to some statistic; weight & movement would affect and deplete stamina at varying degrees, depending on strength and agility. Morale would affect movement speed and disposition (effectiveness) in combat. Stamina level would affect movement speed (and combat AP). If all mercs simply run the same speed, does it mean there is no stamina (or that stamina is disabled when in real-time)? When moving with a group in JA2, you could clearly see if a merc had Athletics, or if a merc had very low agility. They wouldn't move nearly at the same rate. And I guess someone will tell me that it doesn't matter. Or that is too fine of detail to worry about... I beg to differ. This is something that, before seeing the videos in JA3, never really "bothered" me, because JA2 overall mechanics just blend seamlessly in a "believable" way when it comes to a video game. (I get it, real life team would move at the pace of the slowest in the group, meaning for example, a swat team won't leave on of the guys behind because his name is Bubba) 🤣. These guys are mercenaries. Not a swat team. They bicker, bitch and hate one another. Bubba can huff and puff all he wants, Blood is NOT going to slow down for such a jerk. That means, as you're moving around, someone like Blood has the best chances of spotting the enemy. Maybe the enemy also spots him, starting combat. If you decided to not bother with moving in formation, or leaving bubba behind, well he probably won't be of any assistance in the first rounds of combat. This kind of thought behind something as "simple" as movement in between combat became normal, a standard. You learnt this through the gameplay, and when you had enough money, you would subconsciously choose mercs that fit one another well. If you got 5 mercs with good agility, you woulnd't just add Bubba to that bunch. He would be relegated to another less active team for other tasks. This is a "simple" and effective way of also differentiating mercs. You yourself "hate" to wait for the slow one. It reinforces your own likes and dislikes.

Thank you for clearing that up! I've been trying to delay watching such long videos. Glad it's there. Still, a few concerns with combat; @1:12:xx, when combat is finished, there are enemies literally one building away.. and they in no way even bother to join the battle. Battles all seem to be secluded to 3-4 enemies and that's it. I really hope this is either something that can be tweaked or it can be changed. Also, anyone know if enemies will climb ladders? (JA2) Later versions of 1.13 changed this behaviour in enemies, so it could be dangerous if you weren't prepared and expect to be a sniping god because you camp a roof. Camping a roof and suddenly being shot at from 2-3 enemies that climbed the roof behind you really makes you think twice about that decision.

1. I repeat this often. What is the point of releasing a game with the numbered version in it, if it's to re-invent it? An example I like is how Jurassic World did things. I'm a fan of the 1993 Jurassic Park. It sits at my top favourite movie of all time, along with Alien and Star Wars. At one point, they decided, ok... we want to re-imagine Jurassic Park. But it will be more modern, it will feel more action oriented, more explosive. Let's respect the fans of the old and also make it for fans of the new; Jurassic World. Jagged Alliance 2 built upon Jagged Alliance 1. Right? If you're going to continue with Jagged Alliance 3, it should build upon JA2. Right! 2. Pent up expectations. Well yeah.. naturally! Many of us here have been playing the game steady and many of its mods for the past 20 years. Some people call themselves fans, played it once or twice in their youth, came back 20 years later.. "oh yeah! that was a great game!! Can't wait for 3" without even remembering WHAT the game is. I, like many others here, have followed EACH and EVERY step as Jagged Alliance 3 was initially announced back in early 2000's, only to have so many twists and turns and crap attempts. When a game is this dear to your heart, you take it seriously after so many failed attempts. I can't tell you how excited we all were when Flashback was announced. They even announced that they were working with modders and Shanga was one of their ressources to help them stay faithful. Flashback is among the worst games I've actually ever played. I finished it and hated it, and the negativity around it is well deserved. Flashback had decision after decision criticized.. The devs would release their ideas, their work so far.. and we would say "hey! no please don't do that!!". They would not listen. Over and over and over. Even Shanga got pissed and tired and said he didn't want to have anything to do with it anymore. ...and look what was released. 3. You are glad it has survived. Me too! But to whom do we owe the fact it survived for so long? The stock JA2? That game was forgotten even from the start. TBS games are never popular. And look at the modding community for it! The way they work the code, make new stories, entire new worlds and complete overhauls of the game. 1.13 is definitely the reason Jagged Alliance 2 is even still talked about. The drive from the modding community to continually expand what is possible in the game. Those are the fans, they are the reason the game is even in the minds of anyone to make nowadays. Who even wants a Jagged Alliance game, other than the hardcore fans? No one! No one even knows what Jagged Alliance is. Just look at all the comments in youtube videos. "Wow! this is like a new Wasteland 3", "Yay!! Another Xcom!" "Oh no, not another xcom clone", "hey! this looks alot like Mutant Year Zero!", "What!! And I never even heard of Jagged Alliance 1 or 2". Only the die-hard fans of Jagged Alliance want another game. So, I think it's kind of normal that you see many critical response. I have deep respect for Haemimont Games. When they first announced the game like 2-3 years ago.. y first reaction was: "Are they crazy!? did they never see the reactions the fans have whenever a new JA game is announced or comes out?" That's what passion does. Intensity comes with it.

That remains to be seen. The amount of times I've see that marketed in games and it ends up simply being fancy words... Jagged Edge - Hired Guns did EXACTLY what this game advertises. Dialogue options. Factions & Allegiances. Let's just say, that yes, it was in the game... but I would take JA2's abstract take any day. Could JA2 have had deeper Faction stuff? Yes. Urban Chaos and Deidranna Lives! kind of explored more factions.. although the coding in JA2 wasn't the best for faction allegiances. I mean, we have soooo many games that do dialogue and "choices" and questing, and "here!! a reward for completing it!". What was nice about JA2 is that they had a bunch of quests, but they are well hidden. No logbook, no hand-holding. You HAVE to figure it out. It's suggested through dialogue, and you do what you want with your own moral compass without needing to be given points or given a thumbs up by the game to tell you you did it or didn't. That's something I hope they don't change. When I first played the game in 1999, I never even realized half the quests that were in game. When I went back to the game years later and eventually also started playing it regularly, I was a little older, and started noticing many hidden things. That - finding new things through replayability - is something I sincerely hope JA3 will have. I don't need every quest to be spelled out for me, I don't want to feel like I'm a child playing a game. Let me discover new things through multiple playthroughs. Now, if the quests and dialogue are well done, now THAT will be awesome!

You brought valid arguments, asked valid questions and shared your concerns. Some people get pissed off if you tackle a worry about a game that they see with rose-tinted glasses. I wouldn't worry too much about it. I don't think you are a "Karen", and actually find whoever said that to be kind of shallow. You didn't REQUEST anything from the devs nor did you say anyone would regret it if they didn't listen to you (the def of a Karen).

I get your point, also think that's why X-Com become so successful. It really took away lots of that micro-management in the combat/tactical phase, instead focused on less detail and a more straightforward approach. I guess if you look at numbers and measure success that way, yes, it is a much better game. For myself, I bought it when it came out, finished it once, tried to go back a few years later, and well.. that's how it ended. The lack of micro-management & lack of freedom means it became forgettable for myself. I always felt Jagged Alliance with it's deeper strategic & tactical layer offered way more appeal to the armchair general type.. you know, the ones who play things like Men of War, Hearts of Iron, Arma, etc.. it focuses on the little detail that our type likes. That the type of person who prefers X-com won't care much about. So many hard-core fans of Jagged Alliance are also fans of games like 7,62mm High Calibre.. another game in the vein of the micro-management style. Guess I'm just a little sad to see it aim to be a more streamlined twist. Not saying it will be bad.. and I can't judge before playing it. Just a feeling.

Hahaha!!! Oui, bien 50/50 Français et Anglais.. je parle plus un Français Canadien même si je suis "Québecois".

I get it. I loved 1.13 for fine-tuning all the macro-/micro-management aspects of the game. More "realistic" guns, pouches, vests, etc.. Variations of the same items. I love that detail. 1.13 brought many features that I found a little lacking in base JA2, making it harder, having huge 2-hour long battles like the Drassen counter-attack. Those we're all part of JA2 from the start, but devs took them out at the end to make it easier. I'm for the detail that brings the game down more to "simulation" level, fully knowing that the game is a top-down isomatric rpg. It's how I get immersed in it. I prefer a granular approach at detail of that kind. For me, stamina, weight, morale, exhaustion... it's all very integral to the experience I want. I try not to watch too many videos (the long ones), not to spoil things. I just didn't look like that in any video I've seen (3-4x 30-45 minute videos). They seemed to click a spot, and the grenades jsut landed exactly where they clicked.

+1 ^ What playes want out of JA3 is extremely divided it seems. Anyways, from my point of view over the years of following convos and such on the Bear's Pit. It seemed to be way more unified what players wanted from a JA3 than what I've been seeing as we get closer to release. Seems as though way more people seem to want a game clsoer to X-Com that doesn't deal with the macro-management part of Jagged Alliance. Maybe that is due to playstyle? Types of games played? Age? As an example, I'm more of a macro-management type of player. I tend to prefer games that go far into crazy detail like walking speeds, bullet count, realistic magazine capacities, recoil. I tend to like games like Jagged Alliance 2, Brigade E5/7,62mm High Calibre, Alfa, Hired Guns, etc... for the more precise approach at those details.. over games like xcom that don't worry about those and focus more on "big picture" stuff. Brigade E5 / 7,62mm High Calibre even had multiple different walking speeds, but that game also played more like Back in Action (real-time w/ pause). I want a game that kind of takes pointers from 1.13 with the pouches, vests, gear over a game that ditches those in favour of a inventory system that harkens back to JA1. For the same reasons I would never go back to JA1, simply because I find the management of the inventory, mercs and other fine detail too simplistic, I also want the detail found in 1.13, but in a new game. I also find such "unnecessary" detail like walking and running to be important. Anyways, you've mentioned exactly the same reasons I had. But yeah.. I think that stuff is important to the overall feel of the game.

The wording makes it appear as though everything is the same: It really depends HOW they implemented those. In JA2, a certain action could be affected by more than one stat. Not sure what you mean by "more complex" though. I hope the functioning under the hood will be similar here. I just look at the way grenades seem to be thrown, and they don't appear to be governed by ANY stat (other than disatance due to STR). They seem to be exactly the same as X-Com, where you know exactly where they will land and that's all there is to it. Taking away a little bit from the chaotic and uncertain nature of combat in JA2 (I consider that uncertain nature the fun risky part).

That ^ Yeah, I understand, you're anxious for the mods. I find it a little unfair to just ASK for mods to be made. I mean, those who make mods actually spend so much of their own free time to mod something they like/dislike and usually end up sharing that with others. If there is something you find you'd like to change, why not maybe try and learn how to mod yourself? I'm not trying to be insulting, but you're pretty much asking for others to do something YOU want to benefit from, without yourself contributing. (Sure, maybe if a mod is being worked on and you follow/test it, the one(s) working on it might like playtest feedback.. but I'm talking about straight up asking for huge mods to be made and what are YOU contributing?)

I think it is really too bad they scrapped an entire RPG system for their own take at streamlining something that wasn't even all that difficult to start with. It feels like a hodge-podge of mashups of different systems and then brainstorming HOW they can implement different features from it. For ****sake, they keep advertising they had Ian Currie on board.. so why the F*** just not use JA1 & 2 Stat system? For a Tactical TBS Game, it was pretty unique and fun. Really wish they just kept the core of the games. Maybe THQ told them it had to be simpler, more like modern tbs games.

Jagged Alliance 2 wasn't a military simulator. It's on the actual boxes. ROLEPLAYING STRATEGY Roleplaying was the most important part of Jagged Alliance, as that is the point of the freedom to do whatever you wanted, whenever you wanted. As stupidly or as reasonably as YOU wanted. Sure, Jagged Alliance has attracted a hardcore bunch of gun nuts.. myself included, still.. not a simualtor in any way. What I liked most about 1.13 was the addition of 1000's of guns and the dedication to recreating them to a degree of realism considering the type of game. If JA was realistic, you would have a base of operations, logistics, etc.. all that is besides the point. We want a realistic view on an action movie. Anyways, the idea that you ENTER active combat doesn't make sense in JA as again, you're a roaming band of Mercenaries without a real place to stay or without a real base of operations. So you lug around stuff. Xcom might be more realistic in that approach, due to the fact you have a base of operations, a command area from which you fly out. I'd still much rather play a game where I get the freedom to equip 5 tool kits on my merc, because that's what I choose, than the game to dictate what I can or can't do. Seeing how my choices affect the outcome of combat is something I appreciate more than playing within very limited confines of a game.

I guess that's something that happens when a forum gets big enough.

Make the relevant conversations relevant.